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  • These changes will apply to every Rip article (416 articles) so it should be discussed here.

    Here the recent changes by Maczkopeti :

    - adding quotes to Rips/Songs and putting Albums in italic, including titles. I'm okay with it.

    - changing the introduction phrase: "Rips" is a high quality rip of "Song" from Game -> "Rips" is a high quality rip by SiIvaGunner. 

    I personnally prefer the first introduction phrase because some games are obscure so I think it may help people to precise that this rip name means is actually a rip of this song from this game. Also, saying a rip is from SiIvaGunner on SiIvaGunner wiki isn't really useful. Of course the introduction phrase changes for special rips. And I think adding the publication date and the event in the introduction can be a nice addition, too. What do you think?

    About the Rip infobox:

    The rip infobox is probably going to be changed so I recommend you to look at the thread Proposal: New rip infobox . Also, for the Playlist and Album(s) parameters, do we have to put an external link, a link to an article (or category) on the wiki, or both? Is the external link really useful if there is a link to an article?

    Example for both links:

    - Playlist: Undertale (external youTube link)

    - Album(s): PC Master Rips (external Bandcamp link)

    If you have any other suggestion about the formatting of Rip articles, you can ask it here.

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    • My 2 cents:

      1. My suggestion: "RIP" (bold, in quotemarks) is a high quality rip of "TRACK" (non-bold, non-italic, in quotemarks) from the game GAME (italic).

      I agree that putting "by SiIvaGunner" on every single rip in the SiIvaGunner wiki is pointless. I understand that it's like that on Wikipedia, but Wikipedia hosts info about thousands of artists. This wiki only hosts info about SiIvaGunner. So saying that every single time is just superfluous. I agree that mentioning the track name and game title again reinforces the kayfabe nicely, and helps people easily see what's the track name and what's the game title (it's not always easy, if the game's obscure and has a weird title).

      I don't think the date needs to be mentioned in the intro. I understand that it could look nice, but the problem is, a lot of rips have 2 upload dates (GiIvaSunner and SiIvaGunner), and some rips have inconsistent info on the upload date or other complications. It would complicate the intro too much. Better keep it to the infobox, and the Trivia section.

      I strongly disagree with mentioning an event in the intro. Imho the intros should be entirely in kayfabe, keeping with the spirit of the channel. I.e. someone should hypothetically be able to read the intro and still think it's about an actual video game music rip. Mentioning an event or any lore would break that facade.

      2. I don't have any specific opinion on this. But thinking about it – how about we just put wiki links there? The playlist and album pages would already have links to the respective YouTube and Bandcamp pages, wouldn't they? So to save both wiki space, and time spent on articles, I think putting just wiki links would suffice.

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    • Merrygoroundoflife wrote:
      Also, for the Playlist and Album(s) parameters, do we have to put an external link, a link to an article (or category) on the wiki, or both? Is the external link really useful if there is a link to an article?

      HughMungusEsq wrote:
      The playlist and album pages would already have links to the respective YouTube and Bandcamp pages, wouldn't they? So to save both wiki space, and time spent on articles, I think putting just wiki links would suffice.

      I would say for convenience it's good to put both the wiki link and the external link for the Playlist and Albums. Sometimes wiki readers (especially on mobile) have trouble clicking links and don't want to navigate through several pages to get to the page they want.

      There's also the fact that some articles / categories might not be created and have that link, which is why I've made it a habit to include lines like: "This album was announced with the video ((LINK)) (YOUTUBE)" which will be changed to "This album was announced with the video ((LINK))" once the page is created.

      HughMungusEsq wrote:
      I strongly disagree with mentioning an event in the intro. Imho the intros should be entirely in kayfabe, keeping with the spirit of the channel.

      I agree, but I think that there should be a mention of it in the "Jokes" section, or somewhere other than a category or the Description part.

      I agree with the other intro points.

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    • @Ironwestie: I agree with your arguments re:Links to playlists and albums. I also agree that the event should definitely be mentioned in the Jokes or Trivia sections + in the Categories; in my previous post I was only talking about the intro.

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    • I don't think the version/mix should be mentioned in the introduction phase. I think it should just tell what song (actual name of the song) it's a rip of:

      Song Title (Made Up Version Tag) - Game Name is a high quality rip of "Song Title" from Game Name.

      or

      Made Up Song Title - Maroon GO is a high quality rip of "Maroon 5 Song" from Maroon GO.

      ...Unless it's the joke (Song That Might Play When You Fight Sans - Undertale, All Circus Rips).

      We don't make the reader think Waluigi's Tacostand is a real game, so we shouldn't make them think there exists an unused version of the DK Rap.

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    • We don't make the reader think Waluigi's Tacostand is a real game – Why not though?

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    • HughMungusEsq wrote:
      We don't make the reader think Waluigi's Tacostand is a real game – Why not though?

      Isn't this wiki about Explaining the Meme RipsTM? And I mean that seriously, too.

      @Everyone I will be implementing the new rip infobox changes this weekend on Saturday at 12:00 NN (PST, or UTC-8) unless there is an objection. If you have any questions about the infobox, please leave them in that thread.

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    • I'm more with Ironwestie and Therunawaychuggaa, it should be clear in the article or Waluigi Tacostand's category page that Waluigi's Tacostand is not a real game, even if that doesn't follow the spirit of the channel.

      Previous points: if we keep the actual Rip infobox, putting only the internal or external link is better than putting both since that's the simplest solution, what people who don't know the wiki will do.

      About the new rip infobox: is the goal to fill the description for every rip? Just wondering because it will take some time.

      I also agree that alternate mixes should not be mentioned while saying "high quality rip of "song" from game" (it seems we agree to keep this format), unless that's really the case ("Dire Dire Docks (OST Version)" for example, it exists).

      Finally, I'm not sure if a date or an event is more relevant in the "Jokes" or "Trivia" section than in the intro. We'll keep it in the infobox only then, same for the length of the rip.

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    • I agree that a fake game's fakeness should be mentioned somewhere in the article. What I'm suggesting, however, is that we shouldn't break the kayfabe in the article Intro. Maybe explain that it's a fake game in the Jokes section. What do you think?

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    • The Jokes section should only be about the different Jokes of the rip imo. The Trivia section should be better then.

      I don't know about mentioning that a fake game is fake in every Rip article though. This will require putting roughly the same phrase into every article from the same Playlist (example: LazyTown: The Video Game) and newcomers won't think about doing it. And I mean it's already in the category page. It would be nice but for now we should probably keep that for specific rips.

      An example of putting the event in the Trivia section done well: "It's a me, Mario!" - Super Mario 64. But this is probably too specific.

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    • Yeah, that would be fine. I just meant, don't tell it outright in the article's intro if possible.

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    • Merrygoroundoflife wrote:
      if we keep the actual Rip infobox, putting only the internal or external link is better than putting both since that's the simplest solution, what people who don't know the wiki will do.

      Funny you say that, because I've been working on a new form for rip pages. It tells an editor what to put in the infobox's parameters, so you can see how you can put both the internal and external link in the infobox. One parameter for internal, and the other for external.

      Merrygoroundoflife wrote:
      About the new rip infobox: is the goal to fill the description for every rip? Just wondering because it will take some time.

      For consistency, I think that yes, we should, especially for rips that have jokes in their description. It's important that we accurately chronicle the entirety of the joke of a rip as well as the original song. I know that will take a bit of time, but it will also take a bit of time to properly format the links in the infoboxes.

      ALSO, today is Saturday, and it is currently 8:12 AM PDT (I forgot to include the Daylight Savings Time; the timezone is UTC-7). The infobox change happens in FOUR HOURS! ~ironwestie (talk to me)(contribs) 15:15, June 3, 2017 (UTC)

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    • Yes, I saw the Rip form, I had no idea such a thing was possible. I commented on the talk page on there, about a "Joke" or "Jokes" section, by the way.

      If we are determined to do so, then I'm okay to include the description on every rip article.

      Ironwestie wrote:
      It's important that we accurately chronicle the entirety of the joke of a rip as well as the original song.

      I totally agree with this. Sometimes we are probably not looking enough at the original song.

      Thank you for working on all this, it's great!

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    • Re: descriptions: yes, there's a lot of articles, but I don't think that adding descriptions will be an urgent task. It's like with rip length: originally the Rip template didn't include rip length, later it was added. Now a lot of rip pages still don't have rip length in their templates. So when I come around a rip article that doesn't have rip length in the template, I usually make sure to add it. The same thing with "Rips by month" categories, a lot of pages still don't have them. This doesn't mean we have to drop everything and start editing every single article. It's not an urgent project, more like an ongoing one.

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    • I'd like to make an arguement about the redundant nature of the introduction phrase. Consider this:

      '"[Song] - [Game]" is a high quality rip of "[Song]" from [Game].

      I feel that this is more presentable:

      '"[Song]" is a high quality rip from [Game].

      I also think deviations are allowed if there's something more about the song that the song title in the rip doesn't say. For example, here's the current introduction in the article for Trailer Theme (In-Game Mix) - Sonic Mania:

      "Trailer Theme (In-Game Mix) - Sonic Mania" is a high quality rip of the trailer theme for the game Sonic Mania made by Hyper Potions and Nitro Fun.

      Ideally, it would look something like this:

      "Trailer Theme (In-Game Mix)" is a high quality rip of "Checkpoint", a song originally made by Hyper Potions and Nitro Fun, that was repurposed to promote the game Sonic Mania.

      This is because "Checkpoint" was not officially part of the Sonic Mania soundtrack, and its inclusion in Mania's trailer does not indicate that it will appear in the actual game. This was similar to Nintendo using music from the 1982 film Conan the Barbarian to promote three different Legend of Zelda games (specifically, Ocarina of Time, The Wind Waker, and Twilight Princess), even though the song itself is not in any of the actual games.

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    • My two cents (which doesn't make anything final):

      While I don't disagree that your points have merit, I will address the reasons why the current format exists:

      • The reason we have "[Song] - [Game]" is because we treat every rip as a video, so we include the complete title of the rip in quotation marks. This is also the reason why the infobox surrounds the title in quotation marks by default.
        • From an editing standpoint, it is easy to use the following code to show the page's name:
      "'''{{subst:PAGENAME}}'''" is a high quality rip of [TRACK] from [GAME]
      

      It is important to make editing and making rip pages as streamlined as possible, especially since we still have about 4500 rip pages to make.

      • In order to preserve the "kayfabe" of the channel, we have an intro paragraph that pretends to show the rip as a legitimate reupload of the original song
        • The length of the introductory paragraph is important because it gives an adequate description of the source video (i.e. its title) and its origin. It also substantiates the kayfabe mentioned above.
        • The kayfabe is broken in the "Jokes" section, which then explains that the rip is a mashup, remix, or something else.

      For your proposed format, my primary concern is that it would be too short to support the kayfabe and describe the rip adequately, although I will note that describing the original track's origin may be a fix.

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    • Here's how "Trailer Theme" could work with the current intro:

      "Trailer Theme (In-Game Mix) - Sonic Mania" is a high quality rip of "Checkpoint", a song made by Hyper Potions and Nitro Fun, that was repurposed to promote the game Sonic Mania.

      If the introduction phrase is confirmed here, it will be in the Rip form and in the Manual of Style.

      Also, a new introduction phrase for removed rips has been proposed: "Rip name" is a rip of "TRACK" from GAME. It has been removed from the SiIvaGunner channel.

      Other concerns:

      • Should we make a link to "high quality rip" in the introduction phrase or not?
      • I'm not convinced that a mention of the event or upload date should not be in the second sentence of the intro. For instance, adding "This rip was uploaded during the Channel Ending" to a rip doesn't break the kayfabe. And saying "This rip was uploaded during Inspector Gadget Takeover" doesn't necessarily mean the rip's joke is Inspector Gadget, as there was rips without that joke.
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    • Why do we need to mention the event in the introduction phrase though? Can't it be reserved for the Trivia section?

      I have doubts about linking to "high quality rip", to be honest, since it's a category and not a page.

      I like the removed rip phrase suggestion. What about rips that have been uploaded to GiIvaSunner, then deleted with the channel, and then never reuploaded?

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    • Excuse me while I just jump into this,

      On a bit of an unrelated note, if there is a page for a particular song on a different wiki, like for all the Undertale songs, should we put a link to the other wiki's page? Would that be helpful for people who have absolutely no idea what they're reading, or would that just complicate the introductary paragraph more than it needs to?

      For example:

      Song That Might Play When You Fight Sans - Undertale is a high quality rip of "Song That Might Play When You Fight Sans" from the game Undertale.

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    • @Stroovething: Imo that should be better left for the category page's Links section.

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    • @HughMungusEsq: k.

      Also, on an even more unrelated note, should we make a wiki for VvvvvaVvvvvvr?

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    • I was thinking there could be a wiki for bootleg rippers like TimmyTurnersGrandDad, BlizzaStunner, or as you said, VvvvvaVvvvvr.

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    • Tbh, I'm personally not familiar with all the SiIvaGunner spin-off channels, mainly because I barely get the time to listen even to SiIvaGunner rips as it is :) Any specific spin-off channels you guys could recommend?

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    • @MungusMan The ones that Chuggaa mentioned are good places to start. This is getting off-topic, we should probably move this to a different page.

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    • Thanks!

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    • @HughMungusEsq

      • I just find it weird for it to be in the Trivia whereas it's something pretty important about the rip.
      • To be honest I think that the Rips and Memes pages are worth an article separated from the category but I also like them as a category so I don't know. But since the Rips category is already on the article, I'm okay for not linking it then.
      • I think the first part of the "Removed rips" intro could suit with non reuploaded rips. The second part could be something like "This rip was uploaded on GiIvaSunner but not on SiIvaGunner" if we agree to talk about this in the introduction. I wonder if they should be called "high quality" or not though. Are we taking GiIvaSunner + SiIvaGunner as a reference for "high quality" or only SiIvaGunner? I mean if the rip was not reuploaded, maybe it was no longer considered high quality".
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    • @Merry

      While I agree it's pretty important to the rip, I still think it should be in some sort of separate section, if not the Trivia section.

      Imagine if you were just someone who has no idea what the channel is and you come across "Slider (CD Version)". Without knowing about the Reboot, this is just a melody swap of the Family Guy theme.

      I think a page for this rip should reflect that by starting with the intro paragraph, an explanation of the surface joke (in this case, the Family Guy theme), and then how it ties into a larger event in the channel (how the first Slider rip was the Flintstones theme and how it was replaced during the Reboot).

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    • @Stroovething,

      Ok, that's a very good point.

      Then let's stay with the event in the Trivia or Jokes section and in the Infobox for now, since it has already been started like that.

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    • @Merrygoroundoflife

      Okay. I'm thinking it should be in the Jokes section rather than the Trivia section.

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    • As an idea: How about a "History" section? Right now, info about the rip's upload history (e.g. for GiIvaSunner reuploads, for removed rips, etc) has no set place: in some articles, it's put in the intro, in others, it's in the Trivia section. Maybe giving it its own section might help tidy things up. Thoughts?

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    • Added a History section to the Battle! (Wild Pokémon) - Pokémon Ruby & Sapphire page. Imho it looks tidier and more informative, when a rip's history is written in neat paragraphs instead of jagged bulleted sentences in the Trivia section.

      But I'd like to hear your opinions!

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    • I agree! It seems like a small change, but I definitely see how it can improve a page.

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    • Yeah, that looks a good idea. I say we start doing that.

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    • Thanks! I've done it in another article (Route 110 - Pokémon Ruby & Sapphire), I'll start doing it in other GiIvaSunner rip articles as well then.

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    • Ok, I just had an idea, so I'm reopening this thread (but I wanted to reopen it anyway).

      What if we used the aforementioned "History" section for mentioning day events instead of "Jokes" or "Trivia"? That section will probably be just a short phrase but it would make way more sense than in "Jokes" or "Trivia".

      Also, we still haven't concluded on the introduction phrase. For instance, I'm using "RIP" is a rip of "SONG" while other people use "RIP" is a rip of "SONG (MIX)". Should I start a new thread for this?

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    • I'm not sure; an event is kind of part of the joke in many cases. Though in other cases it's not. Idk really.

      As for the introduction phase, I just copypaste what's written in the "Music:" line of the description.

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    • HughMungusEsq wrote: As for the introduction phase, I just copypaste what's written in the "Music:" line of the description.

      Oh, ok. It's weird because for the "Music:" line on rips with mixes sometimes I just saw the name of the track and sometimes I saw the track and its mix.

      I was wondering if removing the name of the mix wasn't breaking the kayfabe in a way, because it implies that specific mix doesn't exist.

      Edit: Removed a duplicate post... I should stop editing on mobile, it makes me fail things often.

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    • Merrygoroundoflife
      Merrygoroundoflife removed this reply because:
      Duplicate post
      23:42, September 10, 2017
      This reply has been removed
    • Yeah, descriptions are inconsistent sometimes. Yet I think it's the safest way to go, since it preserves kayfabe: since SiIva himself lists it in the description, that's what the rip is supposed to be of. Or at least, that's the logic I use

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    • Ok, that makes sense.

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    • Quick two cents to throw in. What if instead of saying something like this:

      "Song Name (OST Version)" is a high quality rip of "Song Name (OST Version)" from the game Game.

      We could phrase it like this?:

      "Song Name (OST Version)" is a high quality rip of the OST version of "Song Name" from the game Game.

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    • Good point. It could help to know what the track is when there are brackets in it.

      Example: "Strong One (Masked Man) (OST Version) - MOTHER 3" is a high quality rip of the OST Version of "Strong One (Masked Man)".

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    • Yeah, that does sound less "mechanic" than the current phrasing.

      Though I wonder what the description would be for something like We Are Number One (epic funny meme edition super remastered not gay) - LazyTown: The Video Game lol

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    • "We Are Number One (epic funny meme edition super remastered not gay) - LazyTown: The Video Game" is a non-homosexual super remastered rip of the epic funny meme edition of "We Are Number One" from LazyTown: The Video Game.

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    • This one seems obvious, Iron.

      That rip is a high quality rip of the Fuckin' Bustin the Nut Before You Manage to Pull Out mix of "Circus" from the game Five Nights at Freddy's.

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    • Hey Ironwestie, what do you think of the "History" sections? Is it okay if event days are mentioned in it instead of in "Jokes" or "Trivia"?

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    • A FANDOM user
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